107953-the-nexus-report-nerfing-the-attunement-page-7

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I've read about half of it - not about to read through 43 pages. I feel no need to debate some of the silly "points" brought up by you or others, as I don't see them as legitimate. I am simply making my position known.

Mmm, I think completing the dungeon suggests a player can actually complete content...! Medals are just frosting. It's honestly a bit insulting that y'all are painting every player who will gain access to raids from this point on as some sub-par player who's going to go crying for nerfs. News flash: Just because someone hasn't started WS raids yet doesn't mean they don't have an appreciation for what raiding is like.


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how are they ruining anything? They get to SEE the inside of a zone. So what? IF they can't kill anything and whine and cry and moan which leads to content nerfs then yes, we have a huge problem. But if the only change is about accessibility to the content there isn't an issue. People that aren't skilled/coordinated enough will have to wait for content to naturally nerf itself through players getting more powerful. They will eventually see the content by way of getting carried/dragged. And guess what, these people are probably used to seeing content that way.


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It should be removed it really doesn't serve any purpose. It barely did before, and with the changes it surely does not. What exactly is it there to do? If this is all about player time, and content not being puggable then the attunement process needs to be removed. Stop sugar coating everything with a gradual move to this direction. Remove it and let's be done with it already.


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Lies. Groups disband mid run, or end with no medal from taking too long and wiping over and over.


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I completely agree on making rewards matter again. I completely agree on wanting HARD, challenging content. I think where I disagree is that the challenge should be the content itself - not getting access to it. People want to be bashing their heads against the walls of raids. Not finding static groups for Silver dungeon runs (and at this point in the game when guilds are already raiding it is very hard).


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Well with Bronze change that should def fix groups disbanding for attunement purposes, since I'm pretty sure boss loot tables were not affected by medals. I've even gotten some bronze times on guild runs and the raid imbument gloves still dropped off the last boss.


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I'm for just removing the "artificial game design". The attunement process serves really no purpose. Anyone saying that its teaching you PVE concepts that actually does not entirely follow clearly, because when did it every do that? All the content up to Dungeons and even the content after was/is puggable. That's the real issue here. There's an illusory game design, and one aspect in it is not puggable. Hence its being reworked to be puggable. That's the issue. Timer or no: the problem is pugs fall apart on this content. Now keeping that in mind if we're just keeping in attunements at this point its entirely illusory and serves no purpose, its just something added to pug. You will not be raiding with the pugs you pugged attunement with. So unless we're suddenly doing LFR, which is probably likely, attunement serves no purpose. Remove Attunement.


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I think most people here who are glad about the change would make a distinction between a nerf to content and a nerf to the requirements for accessing content. You can still run silver dungeons if you want to. They have not been nerfed at all. You can still run raids if you want to. They have not been nerfed at all. Attunement isn't content. It's a checklist. They nerfed a checklist. They didn't nerf content.


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That's not what this thread is about. Feel free to start a thread stating that.


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Oh. Now I'm seeing what you're doing there.


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Good on you - However, are you telling me you went in your first time, with no knowledge of the dungeon, no previous experience, no youtube video walkthroughs watched, no strategies read, and one shot it? If all of the above is true, it still doesn't really change the fact that even guild groups required multiple attempts on some if not all of the dungeons to get silver.


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no they didn't but a PUG is not going to sit there with you and wait to learn the fight. If they do that is incredibly rare. Most do a quick vote to quit just based on the challenge given, don't even have to wipe. Am I wrong or right on that? So the change really is to make sure that this kind of thing does not happen. To make the content puggable. That's all I'm saying. And if that's the case then it really doesn't serve any legitimate purpose to raids unless you intend to implement an LFR system. Until then, remove attunement.


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This hits the nail on the head. The attunement process assumes that I want to raid so badly that I will complete the process just to be allowed to enter the raid at all. Not to win it. Just to try it and see if it seems like enough fun that I would want to keep trying it. If that process is so cumbersome that most people throw up their hands and say "forget this", then people don't ever even try the raid to see if they like it. And then the raiding becomes a piece of content that required a lot of time, care, and tuning to make, but that almost nobody even sees.


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My pool caught on fire once. Had to go afk mid fight.


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Its Deadpool. Some questions are better left unanswered.


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Because you learn things even in pugs when you're just starting out? Because while pugs do often include cupcakes, they also often include helpful and friendly people willing to teach tactics and improve the community? They're for people who are more interested in playing the game than they are in winning the uberloot. Or for people who are new to the game and simply don't know what team play involves or how to go about finding a guild. Or for people who are online when others in their guild aren't, who still want to play the team content. The fact that you see nothing of value in puggable content doesn't make puggable content useless. It's part of a process that integrates people new to MMOs into team-oriented play. Which is why it makes perfect sense to make puggable content part of attunement.


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Perhaps they made the change because your experience is not representative of the larger gaming population.


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I killed him US first! Honestly my favorite fight in EQ2 was Roeh Theer. Dat DDR platform!


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WOW, you're the most unlucky guy on the planet, how does that happen?


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You can obviously rent friends.


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The bigger question, I find, is this: Is GA really harder than silver dungeons if, a week after entering, a guild that took 2 months to get attuned, can take down X-89 and get to 8-egg phase Kuralak? In other words: Hi. I'm Atrapos. I watched the Wildstar Raid trailer, and I got really, really excited. I haven't been interested in MMOs in a long time, mainly because the content within them is very rarely challenging on a dexterity level. I like games like Ninja Gaiden, where physical skill is not a nicety, it's a requirement. I was super excited to raid. I finished leveling week 1. I had my GA key day 8. I finished attunement...the week before SSM got nerfed. I am also on Thunderfoot, and I'm in a guild that's finished X-89 (not the server first). I got Wildstar knowing that the raids were going to be difficult. I was excited to have 3 nights a week dedicated to a several hour long session, with guys and gals that I enjoyed playing with, attempting to clear difficult content together. This, to me, seemed like a great way to spend $15 a month. Well worth the price of admission. Never mind the fact that I've spent more hours than I can count building a giant, multi-story tree house. My question to you is, why, after going through the leveling content, can't I start working on raiding? I'm not asking for the raid to be easy. I'm not asking for bosses not to crush my face, or for possibly needing to run adventures, dungeons, or dailies to farm for gear to make the raids easier (through having better stats). In fact, if you got to go DING LEVEL 50 -> RAID, but actually needed some of the gear out of adventures/dungeons, do you know what that would do? Provide incentive to run dungeons and adventures. As opposed to requiring me to silver dungeons, when the content I want to play is 20 man raids. If the raids are as hard as advertised, as awesome as advertised, what are you afraid of, if more people are able to access the content? Are you afraid of increasing the competition for server firsts? Because, honestly, unless you're in DnT, Eugenics, Voodoo, or any of the other big guilds, you need to stop talking. Those guys know how hard it is to get server/world firsts, and they've actually been saying to reduce attunement requirements for a long time. If all the above statements were true, then the raids will stand on their own. More people will have access to it, more people will be able to learn the fights, more resources will be available to teach more people to raid, and more subscribers will exist to keep this game alive for longer. All attunements are is an artificial and needless time block. That's it. Oh, and an epeen inflater. Can't forget that.


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How much experience do you have in GA? X-89 can be 16 manned, as was proved by Enigma. I'd much rather 16 man a boss, than PUG members - a pug can wipe the entire raid, whereas being short-handed only makes the fight take longer. And if you think that's not true, you have absolutely 0 experience in Wildstar's raiding environment.


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In before unsub after 200+ wipes on first GA boss :)


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It's my contention that people that want to raid, knowing that GA is difficult, are more willing to wipe to GA than to wipe in dungeons. In addition, the complaints about difficulty in dungeons was mainly about the timers, as even if you could clear the content, you still didn't get to step foot within GA, unless you could speed run it. So, when Carbine decides you only get to go into Datascape if you can clear the entirety of GA within 4 hours, then your complaint my have merit.


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Hehe. I agree 100%. The best way to learn how to raid is actual raiding. Not banging your fist against a gate.


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