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The poor population in PVP servers made me go PRO-F2P. I went through three dead servers: Pago>Pergo>Warhound. Servers just became ghost towns. At "primetime" evening, most people ever on Warhound on dom side was hovering around 30. There's only one guild left in the whole server  :(. The low level queues don't help either when it doesn't pop anymore. No more low level PVPs or dungeons/adventures. It's just there for display.

1. If multiple queuing is too difficult for the Carbine dev, would redesigning the queue system be harder or easier? In a previous thread, people were talking about a bulletin board style queue. This would potentially make people queue more. Players are able to create rooms with their own title, like "gold dungeon run", "let's play some fungeon", "good pvpers only". Something like that to let players know between if they want to join a more casual play or not. Also, there should be the current number of players displayed on the room queue like 7/10 if I were wanting to join a pbg room. This bulletin system would allow players to see how many people are actually queueing for a particular instance or waiting for them to join. There should also specific tabs to filter stuff players want to play: all PVE, all PVP, dungeon, adventures, ship hands, bgs, arenas, etc. 2. It would help more, but not sure if this would go well with the RPers or lore people. 5. The amps/abilities points that can be gained through pbgs are basically the most alt friendly change Carbine made in a long while. Make it account bound, when you max one char? These silly elder gem system was a turned off point to many people in the beginning. Going through the elder gem system alone would take a person 5-7 months to fully max out ONE character (too lazy to the math). The advantages of that extra amp/ability points is literally night and day difference in PVP and PVE. 7. Yes, plz plz plz. There should be a seven days reward login system. Each consecutive days of logging would bring a greater random reward: day 1 (50 gold), day 2 (1p or boombox), day 7( the most epic mystery box prize or a few plat etc). This should be the next system right after Contracts. 9. No more hardcore crap. That very thought made this ship sunk. Bring someone in that has a personality to create funny and engaging videos or at least hire Frost as a freelancer to make flicks again.


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I suggest these things as solutions to help population rising. We are heading to the first WS anniversary and none of the above is implemented. Not even in the upcoming Drop 5. For the most part, we don't know if they will ever add any of these and in cases like LFG tool or Pets we get Dev comments like . Tbh i don't and i never had any problem with P2P model in any mmo (i pay and play WS, WoW, FFXIV and EvE some times even at the same time 2-3 of them), as long as it provides me the ppl to play all of its content, any time of the day. As long as it has short PvE & PvP queues, no ghost lvling areas, be able to play open world content like events and bosses etc. If these things doesn't happen then there is a problem. So either we will get by Carbine a promise, other than fixes or content addition, that some measures (like the above ones or some others even better) will be taken in the near future, or sadly i ll continue to think and suggest that WS needs a B2P+Sub+CREDD transition.


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The existence of CREDD already puts people on unequal footing by allowing them to, essentially, buy gold, and use that gold to buy things in game that they wouldn't have been able to afford if they were just paying a sub fee. Black Hole Black and Supernova White dyes are currently going for 49p and 52p, respectively, on the CX on Entity. CREDD is going for 15p. What's to stop someone from purchasing a few CREDD and selling them in-game so they can buy those dyes? Is spending $80 on CREDD to get enough platinum to purchase a rare dye on the CX really that different from spending real money to purchase it from a Cash Shop? There are also a bunch of Power 1904 weapons on the AH for between 20 and 30p, and a Power 3226 sword for 140p. I can't imagine someone willing to shell out $180+ in order to get that sword, but they could. Certainly they would have an advantage over players who didn't spend the money. Granted, it would be different from putting something exclusively in the Cash Shop, but the effect is the same, in that players that pay get more.


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I have tried these games, but yes, I don't consider it wise to support games with this product model. You may wonder why, why on Earth would it matter if you just drop in to play an F2P game? Because how we spend money and time has value, and to back this payment model, even if you don't pay into it, is to back the principle behind it's existence. That it's okay for you to not be accountable. It isn't. It has never been. This idea is born out of a huge disagreement I seem to have with everyone about advertisements. I keep raising the idea here, and people very often who would be just fine if there was a cash shop targeting someone else suddenly wouldn't be necessary if every single player was individually accountable. Why is everyone so averse to the idea? It works perfectly well for services like Pandora and Hulu, so it's not new in this context. Ads worked perfectly well for bringing television to us for decades. You wouldn't be a drag on the broader game, in fact you'd be directly accountable for down to the minute. So, why will people gleefully spout F2P and B2P propaganda, then cringe when ads are brought up? Because they've had about thirty years of anti-commercialism coupled with about twenty years of the infomercial "free gift" mentality that gave out worthless crap in order to gouge us later. There are few worse payment models out there for the quality of games and the value of our money than F2P, yet here people are, still asking for it and saying they would support a shift to it. So no, I don't think people are foolish for it, but the idea that we've gone straight from "if subs don't work, go F2P or B2P" is the actual closed-minded argument. Examining and rejecting a bad idea for yourself and for the game is hardly closed-minded, especially in the presence of better logical option. As you can probably see from the relatively voluminous writing I've done on the subject, it's not like I never considered it and rejected the idea out of hand. I examined it and rejected it because there couldn't be a worse possible payment model. Especially for me, since I am the target of these schemes, a person who had money to spend on games. Right now, 15 dollars a month gives me completely equivalent access to everyone else; the CREDD users and we are all on the same level and nothing strictly requires my additional expenditure to have. I, nor do many others, really benefit from having Carbine suddenly making all their money by making things to try to sell to us and therefore not worrying about the game. You don't get Drop 3, Drop 4, or Drop 5 from a company that isn't rewarded directly for having you in the game. You get thirty more mounts that are faster than the ones you can get in game, gear that send you directly to the endgame, anything they can do to actually make money. It's short sighted on the part of the entire MMORPG community to have accepted this as the status quo, to vilify a game company requiring less than dinner for two at Wendy's a month and laud a payment model specifically meant to target players. We should be better than this, smarter than this. We should have held players accountable a long time ago and told them that nobody plays for "free". The onus of recuperating the lost revenue on someone not paying money themselves or not playing to purchase game time with the currency themselves should have always laid on those players. There's nothing closed-minded about knowing there are far better options and finding the excuse that the poor free players don't want to be personally inconvenienced for the simple crime of not wanting to contribute at all to the game to be lacking. That model doesn't deserve my money, my time, or my patience. It's player predation, pure and simple, and I'm not fool enough or ethically comfortable to even provide my time to it. I'm not even comfortable with the subscription games with game cash shops, gouging their players for more money. We have other options, I'm certainly not supporting any game's parent developers that ignore them.


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Not what I meant but just to reply, that doesn't mean carbine would do it bad. By saying you will NOT play because its F2P is actually closed minded. I dont really like F2P games (as my main MMO) because they do lack constant new content, but thats not the point. The point being, that not even giving it a try is closed minded. The meaning of being closed minded actually describes perfectly what you have described.

Wasnt meant for you Oliviar :-P was building upon my previous post <3

Vic, you can type walls of text all you want, I have said before, I agree with what you saying. What I do not agree with is your  view of "you are not stupid" because you dont play F2P games. It gives the impression that anyone that does, is stupid, anyone that doesnt agree with you is, and on top of that, I dont agree with the "wildstar goes F2P = I quit" post just because I believe in giving something a chance before bashing it. I hate MOBA's (Dota 2 and LoL) but I still gave Heroes of the Storm a go (still didnt like it) just in case I may like it! I like to believe that in a pile of silage, you may find a diamond, which is the mindset I am trying to keep IF (take note it is in capitals) Wildstar goes F2P. Keep in mind, I am not having a go at you, honestly I think you are a nice human being, just do not agree with your view of F2P :-P


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I should mention that Esper's mostly right, though I can mention one more thing. It may absolutely not help them to go F2P because they already have so many F2P games. In any other case, this isn't an issue, but they risk having more audience overlap if the subscription players leave and the players from GW2, Aion, or Lineage are actually what shows up to replace them. Players coming from their other games will only drop the populations of those other games. So there does come a point when releasing another F2P game will simply not net you enough new money and simply redistribute more of your old money. And if your paying playerbase comes from your other games, you might not make up the difference. It's very possible, considering a lot of people mention GW2 in comparison to this. NCSoft makes no money from GW2 and Wildstar competing.


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